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Bulk Up Now - Warning
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Thelonious Monkfish
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Joined: 20 Apr 2015
Posts: 1906



PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 1:20 am    Post subject: Bulk Up Now - Warning  Reply with quote

I've searched the internet and can't confirm this but have been seeing things that would corroborate it and heard the information first hand from a tobacconist. This is bad new for people who smoke bulk but he informed me that on August 7th the sale of all bulk tobacco will be outlawed. Then he proceeded to explain a group buy thing wherein he being a licensed store would be permitted to still order the sealed 5 pound bags, but no longer split them up into ounces, so he would purchase the sealed bags and the group of customers that went in could split it up. Bottom line no more jars, samples, whiffs, if you want to sample something find 30 other people who do to so you all can split the bag, or just buy you're own. Hoard all the tobacco you can get, this doesn't stop. As he described it right now Lane doesn't know their head from.... Could be worse than it sounds.
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Thelonious Monkfish
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Joined: 20 Apr 2015
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 2:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I found the full legalese document and made myself dizzy for a few minutes reading it, doesn't sound good. Here's a page with a decent summation http://www.cspdailynews.com/categ...a-deeming-regulations-what-s-next

And from that page
"Specifically, the FDA has the authority under Section 907 of the Food, Drug & Cosmetic Act to establish product standards for deemed tobacco products, which allow the agency to restrict, limit or ban ingredients in the deemed tobacco products or constituents in tobacco smoke. Also, the FDA has the power to ban self-service displays of the deemed tobacco products." This may be where bulk blends fall.

If anyone wants to read the legal documents let me know and I'll post what I find.
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WayneD
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Joined: 20 Feb 2015
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Location: Minnesota

PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 1:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Theres a big ol sh*t storm brewing. Whats the govt hate? Smokers. All of em. Pipe smokers, cigar smokers, store bought cig smokers, RYO cig smokers, ecig vapers and everyone in betweeen. Whats the govt love? Taxes. Oh they love them some taxes. And whos been flying under the radar and not paying high taxes? Yep. Pipe and RYO smokers and vapers. The piper wants his pound of flesh and he is gonna hit hard. The following is from Alexs posted article.
"The original predicate date is Feb. 15, 2007. Based on this predicate date, any tobacco product that was on the market as of Feb. 15, 2007, is “grandfathered” and not required to have a substantial equivalency (SE) application or premarket tobacco application (PMTA) filed with the FDA to remain on the market."

What this means is if you had a product on the market, be it  cig tobacco, pipe tobacco, ecig, ecig juice flavor, cigar or anything else the FDA deems as tobacco, before 2007.....youre golden. Anything else put on the market after that date will need to go through an expensive approval process. Thats ANY blend/style of tobacco here on out.  There is a lot of info out on the ol interwebs. If you havent heard about the FDA Deeming. You may wanna get educated real quick. Stock up and prepare for the worst and hope for the best. Just my buck two ninety-eight.
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Thelonious Monkfish
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 1:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Even being "grandfathered" in is no exception...

"However, the FDA indicates that a significant number of deemed tobacco products would need to have SE or PMTA applications submitted in order for the products to remain on the market in the future. In the deeming regulations, the FDA estimates that compiling a single PMTA application will take more than 1,700 hours at an estimated cost of $330,000. Other estimates, by the industry and the Wall Street Journal, put the time and cost estimates much higher."

The writing is ten feet tall... Stock up.
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C.E. Purdy
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Joined: 08 Jul 2014
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 2:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've got a question.  

Isn't this the same FDA that approves every new fangled medicine that comes along?  Only to find out in a few years time that said approved medication gives the patients it was administered to gangrene of the blow hole or some other malady?

If so why the hell isn't the FDA getting sued for its stupidity?  

Now they want to stick their noses in pipe tobacco and related products.  Under the guise of what exactly?  Keeping people safe?  I've got news for them LIFE isn't safe!

Yeah, I'm stocking up!  Baccy don't go bad.  Think I might get a big ole fire proof gun safe.  Fill it up with guns and tobacco!!!!!!!!
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Try a little Old Toby. It'll help settle your nerves. In....and out.
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Thelonious Monkfish
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 3:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Money. "Medicine" makes too much money for them to really interfere with it, the GDP goes up with every person who gets a cancer prognosis, not to mention lobbyists or any of the other crap.

Best part is the whole scrutinizing costly application process needs to be completed in a year by the FDA once it's filed. Totally on them to finish it with no incentive and if they don't then action can be taken.

Heard a California Senator talking about this, can't recall the name, he swore that nicotine was harmful, terrible, so anything with it is the worst. Get educated, I know what goes in my body, nicotine is great stuff and gets me through the day along with plenty of caffeine, which is also good. The real problem was hearing how horribly smoking and smokers or people who use the vapor were portrayed and all from a man pushing the hell out of this who acknowledges that he has never once smoked anything, hates smoke, it's disgusting and he wants to stamp it out. This is not an anomalous mindset, these people are out there and fervent, even holding seats within the govt.

Until they figure out how legislate some crap like this with estate pipes I'm focusing all efforts and allocated money on tobacco. I'm a smoker, if it gets bad enough all I really need is a cob and lifetime supply of tobacco.
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WayneD
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Joined: 20 Feb 2015
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Location: Minnesota

PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 3:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, CE and Alex. The bigguv gave the FDA the power to control tobacco/nicotine related products. Right, wrong or otherwise. Cant put the horse back in the barn now. This is bigguv bureaucracy at its finest. And largest. Its such a large overreach that there could be potential of it failing altogether or in parts. There are pending lawsuits that have been filed by some advocacy groups. This is a good start but, not optimal. There should be a united front from the ecig, tobacco, pipe tobacco, cigar industries and all else concerned. Sadly this will probably never happen. So CE stock up and prepare. A fire safe sounds like a great idea. Yep Alex, you hit it right on the head. Money. Pure and simple. The disinformation that is being spewed by the "i hate everything" crowd is virtually a pack of blatant lies.........that cant be rebutted because the mainstream media is already in on the scam. Good luck to all.
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Thelonious Monkfish
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 4:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

WayneD wrote:
...Its such a large overreach that there could be potential of it failing altogether or in parts. There are pending lawsuits that have been filed by some advocacy groups...


"The FDA states that the new deeming regulations are intended to be severable, which means that if the courts strike down one regulation, the other regulations remain in force. This severability interpretation was likely included in the deeming regulations because of the very real possibility that industry members would file lawsuits to overturn the deeming regulations. In the event any court or other lawful authority were to temporarily or permanently invalidate, restrain, enjoin or suspend any provision of this final rule, the FDA believes that the remaining regulations would continue to be valid."

There's nothing that could have been done a year ago, this has been in the works for so long and too many are indoctrinated to the cause in one way or another. It has tentacles and legs.
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WayneD
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 4:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tentacles and legs? Oh yes, the Kraken has been released!!!!!!!!! The media has been complicit with its disinformation and over sensationalized propaganda over the last couple of years. Change the thinking/perception of the weak minded masses and the niche industries will fall.  Be it true or not.........just keep pushing the narrative. Doesnt sound familiar at all. Does it?
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Steveaux
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Joined: 26 Nov 2015
Posts: 439


Location: The wilds of NW Pa.

PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 5:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I asked P&C about an August 7th Bulk Ban. Their reply is pasted below.

"Stephen,

Thank you for choosing Pipes & Cigars. That information is false. As we begin receiving information we will release it and make our customers aware of how any changes will affect them. For more information, please visit www.FDA.GOV/TOBACCO. There is a lot of misinformation floating around. It is a good idea to be informed.

We apologize for any inconvenience this has caused. Please feel free to contact us with any further questions or concerns.

Sincerely,
Adriene
Pipes & Cigars
Customer Service Supervisor"


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